• @Crampon@lemmy.world
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      -224 months ago

      Yes. Attacking peoples appearance will surely teach the opposition not to do the same.

      Perfectly executed strategy.

        • @leftytighty@slrpnk.net
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          -74 months ago

          they’re so quirky let’s normalize their rhetoric, those weirdos are so silly. you wouldn’t wanna be seen as lame by voting for them.

          I’m so glad Democrats pulled out all the stops

          • @prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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            4 months ago

            Well, they tried “fascist,” but Americans are literally too fucking stupid to know what that means.

            They should have just lied, I guess.

    • @sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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      4 months ago

      Lol. He’s actually 6’3" though (190.5cm), so pretty tall.

      Still, I absolutely hate mixing diplomatic/military policy and economic policy. Screw all of that. Doesn’t change his height though.

  • Jesus
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    754 months ago

    These autocrats have always wanted to drop NATO.

    Let’s not pretend like X is their reason. Supporting autocracy is their reason, and now they’re trying to come up with excuses to get the public onboard.

    • @seejur@lemmy.world
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      214 months ago

      Yes, but they need to repay the rat elon for all his support during the campaign. This might even be true

      • @sardaukar@lemmy.world
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        54 months ago

        You wanting the same thing JD Vance wants should trigger a warning in your brain before you say anything else.

      • @perestroika@lemm.ee
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        4 months ago

        So, NATO had a problematic operation, trying to establish (and coordinate the establishment of) guerilla stay-behind troops to use in the event of Soviet takeover - and the operation went especially problematic in Italy during the Years of Lead, where some of those guys associated with right-wing terrorists. The year was 1969 or so.

        Basing on this, how do I conclude anything about the NATO of today?

        Disclaimer: I was asked to hold an anti NATO speech during a protest event during a NATO summit. Being a moderately honest anarchist, I held a speech denouncing the practises seen in Afghanistan (the year was 2012), but emphasized that collective self defense is a valuable thing to have (a common attitude here in Eastern Europe), and added that if the alliance would bother doing what it says on the sticker, I would support it.

        NATO is an alliance of various countries. Some of them aren’t nice or democratic (classic example: Turkey). Mixed bag, and constantly changing. Membership in NATO is not a letter of indulgence for a member state to do anything - allies are obliged to help only if someone attacks a member state. If a NATO member attacks someone else, allies can ignore the affair or even oppose the member (example: Turkey recently bombed Kurdish troops in Syria so sloppily that threatened US troops shot down a Turkish drone).

        • @index@sh.itjust.works
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          -24 months ago

          “According to several Western European researchers, the operation involved the use of assassination, psychological warfare, and false flag operations to delegitimize left-wing parties in Western European countries, and even went so far as to support anti-communist militias and right-wing terrorism as they tortured communists and assassinated them, such as Eduardo Mondlane in 1969”

          Based on this conclude what you want about the NATO of today.

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steadfast_Defender_2024

          • @Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            24 months ago

            As if the US and a whole lot other countries are not doing Psy-Ops and other behind the scenes actions. pulling strings on the world stage.

          • @perestroika@lemm.ee
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            4 months ago

            Based on this, I conclude: the NATO of today is a mostly defensive alliance with some taints in its history.

            It is currently very busy doing a real job - opposing a conquering dictator named Vladimir Putin.

            I wish it luck, as long as it sticks to its declared purpose. If it oversteps, I will revise my opinion.

            • @luciferofastora@lemmy.zip
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              64 months ago

              taints in its history

              Ooh, let’s play “find the dark history”! What better way to distract from today’s issues and avoid talking about solutions for tomorrow’s problem!

              This is me agreeing with you, to be clear. The description “taints in its history” is so ubiquitous as to be useless. Yes, acknowledging the errors of the past is important to learn from them and improve, but the focus needs to be on that learning and improving.

              The NATO has potential to be a force of security. In a modern world, conflict between peers is more destructive than ever and the returns on aggressive action are more strongly affected by the strength of the defense, such a union of forces can discourage attack by making it too unprofitable.

              Of course, that requires the union to actually stand united and the potential aggressor to be reasonable and motivated by the state’s prosperity. Neither of those seem entirely guaranteed right now…

            • @andxz@lemmy.world
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              4 months ago

              Your opinions are certainly grounded in reality at least. It’s refreshing to read something sensible for a change.

            • @index@sh.itjust.works
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              -14 months ago

              It is currently very busy doing a real job

              Yes i’m sure they are doing a very busy job like they were in their tainted history (false flag operations to delegitimize left-wing parties in Western European countries)

              If it oversteps

              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_Response

              “Several of the operations were along the coast in the borders between sea and land, and together with roads and populated areas. Surveillance, patrols, road control posts, vehicle inspection, control of air space, minesweeping, evacuation of civilians, and riot control were important part of the exercise.”

              • @perestroika@lemm.ee
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                4 months ago

                If you are sure about something, then bring evidence of considerable off-label activities.

                In response to your response about “Nordic Response”:

                Surveillance, patrols, road control posts, vehicle inspection, control of air space, minesweeping, evacuation of civilians, and riot control were important part of the exercise.”

                Those are realistic military duties in war time. Every military practises them. Where do you find a fault?

                An example from real life: the Ukrainian military has checkpoints on roads near the frontline. Moving with a vehicle, you’d expect to show papers, say a few words and maybe even show transported goods. The purpose? Finding reconnaisance / sabotage groups, which every competent enemy is expected to send. If an opponent doesn’t send recon or saboteurs, they are fools. If a military doesn’t learn how to deter those, they’re fools.

                How does one learn? After dry reading in a classroom: one holds an excercise. There’s a home team and an opposing team. The home team checks, the opposing team infiltrates. Both teams report what they achieved, results get compared. If the blue team found the “saboteurs”, good. If the red team “blew up” all bridges and pipelines in the area, people think hard about what they did wrong. If they don’t practise, they don’t get to think hard.

                • @index@sh.itjust.works
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                  -24 months ago

                  Those are realistic military duties in war time. Every military practises them. Where do you find a fault?

                  Where do i find a fault in conducting vehicle inspections and riot control at peace time, from an organization with a shady past involving false flag operations, psychological warfare and assassinations aimed at delegitimize left-wing parties.

                  Dunno buddy let me keep thinking

                  An example from real life: the Ukrainian military has checkpoints on roads near the frontline. Moving with a vehicle, you’d expect to show papers, say a few words and maybe even show transported goods. The purpose? Finding reconnaisance / sabotage groups, which every competent enemy is expected to send. If an opponent doesn’t send recon or saboteurs, they are fools. If a military doesn’t learn how to deter those, they’re fools.

                  The ukrainian military also have checkpoints in the west border to make sure any male between 18 and 60 doesn’t leave the country so that they can be forced into war.

                  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobilization_in_Ukraine

                  How does one learn? After dry reading in a classroom: one holds an excercise. There’s a home team and an opposing team. The home team checks, the opposing team infiltrates. Both teams report what they achieved, results get compared. If the blue team found the “saboteurs”, good. If the red team “blew up” all bridges and pipelines in the area, people think hard about what they did wrong. If they don’t practise, they don’t get to think hard.

                  To me this sound like military rhetoric coming from a military man. You self defined yourself as being a moderately honest anarchist, i suggest you to keep doing your anarchist readings and re-read the works of Emma Goldman and Errico Malatesta.

                  https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/emma-goldman-preparedness-the-road-to-universal-slaughter

                  https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/errico-malatesta-the-european-war-and-the-international-workers-organization

            • @antidenialistcnt@lemmings.world
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              4 months ago

              Bitch the NATO put yeltsin in place in the first place. I hope you gets drafted and dies for the war machine you’re supporting, idiot. These cunts murdered politician and your “anarchist” ass is defending them lmao you’re a fucking scum

              • sunzu2
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                14 months ago

                said a guy living under nato umbrella 🤡

                How is that coffee in your posh good? living large?

          • @JeffKerman1999@sopuli.xyz
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            14 months ago

            Yeah dude! Tell them! Also tell them what was the normal operations at the time! And what are Russia and China doing today!!!

  • Lord Wiggle
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    114 months ago

    I believe I speak for all of us Europeans when I say he can go fuck himself while sucking off Elon’s micropenis.

  • @BastingChemina@slrpnk.net
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    394 months ago

    France’s military industry is having wet dreams thinking about it.

    If the US pulls out of NATO France becomes the biggest arms exporter of NATO and I would expect other countries will become less enthusiastic at the idea of buying US weapons systems.

      • @BastingChemina@slrpnk.net
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        54 months ago

        https://cdn.statcdn.com/Infographic/images/normal/18417.jpeg

        Here is the share of global arms export per country.

        Germany, Italy and the UK are also big exporters but still behind France.

          • @BastingChemina@slrpnk.net
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            34 months ago

            It’s not that surprising once you know that their goal is to be completely independent for their US for their military equipment.

            It includes the nuclear bomb, missiles, fighter jet, aircraft carrier, submarines, even space capabilities (even if this last part has been lacking a bit lately).

            They don’t have the US military budget but they want the same level of technology without any ties to the US.

            It means that they are exporting a lot to compensate for the high investments they are pouring into military technology.

      • sunzu2
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        34 months ago

        Germany sells to KSA and the likes, now a lot is going to ukraine.

        Their own equipment is unmaintained pile of trash due to US having 40k troops deployed there. Although maybe that is finally changing.

    • @DarkFuture@lemmy.world
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      74 months ago

      Yup.

      In case anyone hasn’t noticed, the goalposts for norms have significantly shifted in the last decade. This is historically how it always begins.

      Buckle up. Protect yourself.

    • @blue_berry@lemmy.world
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      4 months ago

      Yes, and if called out, they say it happens for freedom of speech, which is absurd given that the richest man on earth provides the infrastructure and has a large presence on the platform himself.

    • @blue_berry@lemmy.world
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      4 months ago

      Yes, and if called out, they say it happens for freedom of speech, which is absurd given that the richest man on earth provides the infrastructure, (soon) influences the legislative rules and has a large presence on the platform himself.

    • @prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      4 months ago

      The “it can’t happen here” mentality is so ingrained, that I feel like even many of the people who know that it is bullshit, still aren’t fully comprehending what is coming. Which I get, because it’s hard to comprehend. But boy is it frustrating.

  • @filister@lemmy.world
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    64 months ago

    I guess the next four years will be “interesting” and divisive. This world is going from bad to worse.